№ 82. David Talbott and Wallace Thornhill

PAGE STATUS: These two men are at the forefront of a new scientific revolution, one in which I am sure Sir Francis Bacon would have thoroughly approved. If you walk away from me with nothing else, walk away with these two men.
LAST UPDATE: November 12, 2020

David Talbott

Wallace Thornhill

Thunderbolts Project (YouTube channel)

Remembering the End of the World (Full Documentary)


It’s time to wake up.

The history of our world is not what you think.

BEFORE THE END OF THE LAST WORLD: The polar configuration of the planets at midnight with Proto-Saturn in the background, Venus (bright white), and then Mars. The crescent shape is the Sun shining on Proto-Saturn. It was never fully dark in the last world.

New voices crying in the wilderness

We stand at the cusp of a new era in science. To borrow from the Bible (Psalm 118:22), Immanuel Velikovsky, “the stone which the builders refused is become the headstone of the corner.” David Talbott of The Thunderbolts Project™ was the first to use the term “consensus science,” replacing the more familiar “mainstream science.” For those of you unfamiliar with this man, he dedicated 20 years of his life to advancing the work of Immanuel Velikovsky, only to walk away in disgust in the end, unable to gain the ear of his contemporaries, and selling his entire library. Then along came Wallace Thornhill of the Electric Universe, offering intellectual support and rescuing Velikovsky’s protégé from obscurity.

Since these two men joined forces they are revolutionizing scientific thought. We do indeed live in an electromagnetic universe. Plasma science supports myth. And Walter Cruttenden of the Sirius Research Group at the Binary Research Institute supports the Dogon tribe in West Africa. The past and present are melding. These three men and a growing list of other men and women who have joined forces with them are doing their utmost to put a stop to the prevailing mathematical insanity, to the grotesque cult of Albert Einstein symbolized by a man holding a piece of chalk and standing in front of a chalkboard full of inscrutable mathematical equations. They are the new voices crying in the wilderness.

Catastrophism 101 (a five-step YouTube video course)

If you are not familiar with the work of Immanuel Velikovsky and David Talbott very little that I say will make any sense to you. If you want to know the real history of our solar system, you need to thoroughly study these men. There are two problems. One is time, and the other is access to their writings. On this page I provide you with a carefully guided (i.e. I put a LOT of time and thought into preparing this course and vetted hundreds of YouTube videos, most particularly into the order of presentation) bootstrap, self-taught Catastrophism 101 course. I really do not think you will find a better course online, or on campus, for that matter. Follow it and discover the reality of the world in which you live.

“50 comets in [Roman] skies”

Start your journey into catastrophism here, in the company of what I believe to be one of the most intelligent and intellectually boldest men alive, Wallace (“Wal”) Thornhill. This is as great little YouTube video with which to introduce yourself to catastrophism. It has a 8:30 runtime. Do not underestimate the motivation of The Progeny of Pythagoras in pushing the Doctrine of Uniformity (a.k.a uniformitarianism, gradualism) agenda down our throat. It is the most powerful force at work in human consciousness. It lulls mankind to sleep like nothing else could. The basic thought is that change occurs so slowly as to be meaningless in a single lifetime. This simply is not true. The history of the world is written in catastrophes, one after another, after another. The curtain is opening on the next one in this endless drama. Will you be snoring in the front row when it does? Wake up to the reality in which you live before it is too late.

Congratulations. You’ve taken the first step. Now keep going!

The father of catastrophism

There are exactly eight hours of carefully vetted YouTube Videos about Immanuel Velikovsky at the bottom of my Immanuel Velikovsky page. This is a big investment in time, but one I hardily recommend. Because of his influence on David Talbott, Immanuel Velikovsky must be identified as the Father of Catastrophism. (Other candidates are Georges Cuvier for his work on extinction and to a lesser extent René Thom for his work on catastrophe theory.) Please understand that if you make the investment in time to watch all of these Immanuel Velikovsky videos, the intent is more than to introduce you to the concept of catastrophism. They are intended to give you a feel for the profound impact Immanuel Velikovsky and catastrophism is having even now in awaking thought from the deep sleep induced by Charles Darwin’s On the Origin of Species or more generally evolution and the closely related Doctrine of Uniformity (a.k.a. uniformitarianism or gradualism). I stress doctrine because none of it is true. I particularly enjoy the 1950s scenes from the planetarium in the first video listed in the Historically Interesting section.

Before moving on, it is important to grasp a very important difference between Immanuel Velikovsky and David Talbott. The following sentence from the Preface to Worlds in Collision is often quoted.

This book describes two acts of a great drama: one that occurred thirty-four to thirty-five centuries ago, in the middle of the second millennium before the present era; the other in the eighth and the beginning of the seventh century before the present era, twenty-six centuries ago. [red-bold emphasis added]

If we can trust the work of Jno Cook, there are exact dates for these two events.

1492 BC, April 19 – Disturbances by Venus (Typhon), Exodus, 20 years of cloud cover, 360-day year, axial inclination to 30 degrees.

747 BC, February 27 – Mars jars Earth. 365.25-day year.

— Jno Cook Chapter 4: The Nevada Conference, New Postulates

The index to Immanuel Velikovsky’s work at The Immanuel Velikovsky Archive, includes the following entry:

In the Beginning, the story of the catastrophes that preceded those described in Worlds in Collision.

The Introduction to “In the Beginning” begins as follows:


This volume carries the name In the Beginning—the words with which the book of Genesis starts. The name seems appropriate because it describes the cosmic events which are narrated in the first book of the Hebrew Bible; but also because in it I speak of events that preceded those described by me in Worlds in Collision—thus the name of the book conveys to the reader the notion that here is an earlier history of the world compared with the story of Worlds in Collision; although it is the second volume in that series, in some sense it is the first volume, being the earlier story.

When the manuscript of Worlds in Collision was first offered to the publisher (Macmillan Company, New York) it contained a brief story of the Deluge and of the cataclysm that terminated the Old Kingdom in Egypt. But after one of the publisher’s readers suggested that the book should concentrate on one event, we compromised in presenting in the published volume two series of cataclysms—those that took place in the fifteenth century before the present era and were caused by the near-approaches of Venus, and those that occurred in the eighth century before this era and were caused by the near-approaches of Mars. The unused material was left for elaboration in a separate work on “Saturn and the Flood” and “Jupiter of the Thunderbolt.” The reception of Worlds in Collision, however, made me understand that I had already offered more than was palatable. And so I did not hurry with what I consider to be the heritage of our common ancestors, an inheritance of which my contemporaries in the scientific circles preferred not to partake.

Stated more simply, “in the Beginning” is everything that happened before the “two acts of a great drama” discussed in Worlds in Collision. This book was never published. In fact, in a Technical Note about the same, Velikovsky’s assistant states”

…this work will probably never see publication. — Jan Sammer

David Talbott’s work corresponds to the period of time covered discussed in “In the Beginning.” This is a vital point to understand. The more well known, published work of Immanuel Velikovsky (e.g. Worlds in Collision) does not overlap with David Talbott’s work on the polar configuration.

More specifically, I would say the work of David Talbott roughly corresponds to PART II: SATURN AND THE FLOOD in Velikovsky’s “In the Beginning.” While watching David Talbott’s more recent videos entitled “Discourses on an Alien Sky” (see below), I would highly recommend dabbling in Immanuel Velikovsky’s “In the Beginning.” It is some fascinating stuff.

Archetypes (definition)

Before we proceed, a word to the wise; David Talbott’s constant use of the term “archetype” is more than a little distracting. His usage is not in question. (In fact, he did not originate this use. David Talbott inherited this use of archetypes from Carl G. Jung, author of Man and His Symbols. See Jungian archetypes for a discussion. And, according to Wikipedia, “Jung’s idea of archetypes was based on Immanuel Kant’s categories, Plato’s Ideas, and Arthur Schopenhauer’s prototypes.”) It’s just a specialized usage with which most people are not familiar. In this context, archetype means “a recurrent symbol or motif in literature, art, or mythology” (emphasis on mythology). It is this definition of archetype that leads to the title of one of David Talbott’s earliest YouTube videos “Symbols of an Alien Sky.” These symbols or archetypes are images, petroglyphs (rock art), hieroglyphs, “universal motifs,” “global themes of myth,” “geometric signs” (from Genevieve von Petzinger in her TED talk below), and more. This sky is “alien” to us not so much because the planets were in a different configuration but because they were much closer to Earth and in an entirely different configuration known as the “polar configuration.”

The Polar Configuration (from “Remembering the End of the World”) as it appeared from Earth. From left to right is Jupiter, Proto-Saturn (no rings), Venus, and Mars.

“Some suppose that in the final catastrophe the earth, too, will be shaken, and through clefts in the ground will uncover sources of fresh rivers which will flow forth from their full source in larger volume. Berosus, the translator of [the records of] Belus, affirms that the whole issue is brought about by the course of the planets. So positive is he on the point that he assigns a definite date both for the conflagration and the deluge. All that the earth inherits will, he assures us, be consigned to flame when the planets, which now move in different orbits, all assemble in Cancer, so arranged in one row that a straight line may pass through their spheres. When the same gathering takes place in Capricorn, then we are in danger of the deluge.”

Book III. Which Treats of the Different Forms of Water, Section XXIX, Translated by John Clarke, Delphi Complete Works of Seneca the Younger (Illustrated) [bold-red emphasis added]

I have found no one as yet to suggest that the Polar Configuration of the planets explains why most of the earth’s land mass is in the Northern Hemisphere. The gravitational pull of Proto-Saturn which significantly decreased gravity on earth would have also pulled on these land masses

The polar configuration of the planets

The word polar is defined as “relating to the North or South Pole.” This ancient configuration of planets is known as the “polar configuration” because the North Pole of Earth pointed to the south pole of Mars; the north pole of Mars pointed to the south pole of Venus; the north pole of Venus pointed to the south pole of Proto-Saturn; and finally (you guessed it), the north pole of Proto-Saturn pointed to the south pole of Jupiter. This configuration is also referred to as an axial alignment of planets and a collinear system. Proto-Saturn was larger than Jupiter and thus Jupiter may not have been visible from Earth. And of course, Venus and Mars were much smaller, so Proto-Saturn dominated the sky. Being in an axial alignment, Proto-Saturn was in the same fixed position as a pole star. Polaris, or the North Star, now occupies that very special, unchanging position is the night sky above the Northern Hemisphere known as the celestial pole.

The polar configuration of the planets at midnight with Proto-Saturn in the background

It is said that throughout the Golden Age the planets stood in line” —David Talbott

Modern cosmology, based as it is on uniformitarianism (read nothing ever changes) cannot accept that the planets were once in a line. But Wallace Thornhill was keen to point out that, after Comet Shoemaker–Levy 9 broke apart, the perfect alignment the fragments assumed before they dove into Jupiter reminded him of David Talbott’s polar configuration.

Presumably, there is an electromagnetic explanation for this as well as for the polar configuration of the planets. Why else would the fragments have assumed this perfect alignment?

“Discourses on an Alien Sky #8 | Visualizing the Polar Configuration” from on the ThunderboltsProject YouTube channel:

In the “alien” sky of the polar configuration, the planets were huge. They did not look like “pinpricks of light,” “minute specks” (both David Talbott expressions) or “moving stars” as we think of them now.

Fresco from Pompei, Casa di Venus, 1st century AD. Dug out in 1960. (credit Wikipedia)

The planets were “gods” in the last world

The planets were so prominent in the sky that the ancients thought of them as gods. And Venus was continually putting on a fantastic light show as it interacted electrically with Proto-Saturn.

Proto-Saturn was larger than Jupiter which was hidden from view on Earth. This is a side view of Proto-Saturn, Venus (putting on her light show), and Mars. (credit)

This is why Venus was originally thought of as a goddess, before “she” (Venus is the only feminine planet) became a comet that terrorized Earth’s inhabitants. This same configuration as seen from Earth would look like the following image take from the opening of Episode 2, “Symbols of an Alien Sky.”

The Cosmic Wheel

Now we are ready to take a look at just one example of an “archetype,” the cosmic wheel. Other names used to refer to this archetype are Sun wheel, solar wheel, Great World Wheel, Wheel of Seater (Saturn) in England, Wheel of Shamash (Saturn) in Mesopotamia, and the Wheelthrone of Buddha. No matter what names is used, they all depict the same thing, which is Proto-Saturn (no rings) with a bright white Venus discharging “spokes” of light back towards Proto-Saturn and the red planet Mars in front. Venus and Mars are in the center of Proto-Saturn. So there are always three planets depicted. This archetypes, as with all of the other archetypes, are simply a stylized depiction of what the ancients saw in the sky.

The Great World Wheel

In “Remembering the End of the Last World,” David Talbott asks, “Where is the Great World Wheel claimed to have once turned in the sky?” Can you see the resemblance of this stone carving to the previous artist rendition of how the polar configuration appeared at twilight? The following image and quotes are from an article entitled “Cosmic Wheel” in which it is shown that this archetype can be found elsewhere in the universe.


E0102-72 is a supernova remnant in the Small Magellanic Cloud, a satellite galaxy of the Milky Way. This galaxy is 190,000 light years from Earth. E0102 -72, which is approximately a thousand years old, is believed to have resulted from the explosion of a massive star. Stretching across forty light years of space, the multi-million degree source resembles a flaming cosmic wheel.

This points to a vitally important truth about the archetypes David Talbott has discovered; many of them are reproducible as plasma experiments in the laboratory, indicating that they are natural electromagnetic phenomena. Indeed, on this basis The Thunderbolts Project™ is “A voice for the Electric Universe” or as I like to say plasma science supports myth.

The following video consists entirely of three clips from YouTube videos produced by David Talbott. The first two clips are from “Remembering the End of the World” and the last clip is from Episode 1, “Symbols of an Alien Sky.” All clips are examples the “Cosmic Wheel” archetype.

David Talbott has catalogued thousands of these”archetypes” (symbols). They are found all over the world. Each depicts some aspect of the polar configuration. The very premise of David Talbott’s work is that because these archetypes are found all over the world in diverse cultures, they each depict some aspect or historical phase of the polar configuration. In this sense, they are telling a real story (not “myth”) in pictures.

The Cosmic Wheel

“Remembering the End of the World”

Kronia Communications and accompanying website kronia.com (now defunct) was David Talbott’s predecessor organization to The Thunderbolts Project™. Thus the YouTube video in this section is one of the earliest he produced. It is also one of my favorites because in it you see his vision of the polar configuration. Like all of videos he has produced, he makes heavy use of old paintings. The presumption is that the artist knew something about the real history of our solar system, though it may be equally true that the painter is merely depicting myths and legends and did not understand the reality (i.e. the polar configuration) underpinning them. These painting are the artistic equivalent of archetypes. You will discover that David Talbott makes heavy use of them in all of his videos. If nothing else, they document the importance of these myths and legends throughout all ages.

I suspect David Talbott is very fond of this video. I use it here as a means of letting him introduce his own work. But you must remember it is a little dated, and a notice to that effect has been inserted at the beginning.

David Talbott’s mentor

“An enormous jungle of absurdities” (David Talbott speaking about the work of his mentor Immanuel Velikovsky)

I was at first shocked when I read the following quote from Jno Cook in the Introduction to “Recovering the Lost World.” Angered might be a better word. I thought for sure he must be wrong. Everyone knows that David Talbott profoundly respects his mentor Immanuel Velikovsky, right? Alas, methinks not. I was wrong.

Every genuine, every serious student must at some point surpass his teacher. And when he does, there is a moment of what I can only describe as resentment that borders on anger, a feeling of betrayal, that you were misguided. I experienced this with my own Christian Science teacher. And with it came a desire to publicly vent that anger. It would seem David Talbott had exactly such a moment with his teacher, Immanuel Velikovsky. He immortalized it in the above video, “Remembering the End of the Last World,” but I cannot agree with him. Velikovsky thought it was important to date these events. So do I.

David Talbott and The Thunderbolt Project knows the what, but not the when. The when is profoundly important to me, and I should think to humanity in general for reasons discussed elsewhere on this website. Since reading this quote and realizing that Jno Cook was not in error, I have come to realize the importance of Jno Cook’s work. We must know the when. When did the polar configuration break apart?

“Many catastrophists still accept Velikovsky’s ideas. Others, such as David Talbott, Wall Thornhill, and Dwardu Cardona of the Thunderbolts group, hold that nothing ever happened after the so-called Polar Configuration came apart in 3147 BC: not with Venus in 1500 BC or with Mars after 800 BC. Considering (as I do) the huge assembly of mythology which recounts these events, spread over three continents, with Mesoamerica detailing this with identifiable dates, I am astounded at the oversight. What else could be expected as the winding down of the cataclysm of 3147 BC with the removal of Saturn except further adjustments and interactions of the loosened planets?”

As of this writing, I think Jno Cook’s date of 3147 is way too late, but I have read precious little of his work. That will soon change. Clearly, David Talbott has walked away from an important part of the puzzle. When did the polar configuration break apart? What forces were at work? Was it the gravitational influence of the Sirius star system? A galactic superwave? What? Knowing when it last happened and correlating that date to the Mesoamerican Long Count calendar can shed light on whether or not it is going to happen again and when. Surely it is going to happen again. Nothing like what Daniel the prophet and Christ Jesus spoke of in the Bible has happened since those two men were alive. Both men said it would be the worst thing that has ever happened to the planet. Presumably, this includes the breakup of the polar configuration and the total destruction of the planet in 9500 BC. I should think we would be doing everything possible to know when this is going to happen. The when is important for our very survival.

“Symbols of an Alien Sky”

This is the original “Symbols of an Alien Sky” video. It is now part in a series (the firs episode). As of this writing, there are three episodes, but the other two episodes (“The Lightning-Scarred Planet, Mars” and “The Electric Comet”) are focused on the Electric Universe. They will doubtless be part of the Electric Universe 101 course. I think the best way to regard this vedio is that it is an updated version of “Remembering the End of the World” watched in #3 above. Here is the YouTube description of this video as published on December 4, 2012:

Here we offer David Talbott’s first glimpses of celestial dramas in ancient times. Just a few thousand years ago a gathering of planets hung as towering forms in the ancient sky close to the earth, provoking spectacular electric discharge formations above our forebears and inspiring the vast complex of world myths and symbols. — ThunderboltsProject

The “Discourses on an Alien Sky” playlist

This is an ongoing series. I am not computing a runtime for this playlist, but individual episodes are generally only five to ten minutes long. If you need to jump into the middle of the playlist, individual episodes are listed on the ThunderboltsProject YouTube channel.

A beginner’s guide to the electric universe

Beginner’s Guide

Research notes

Genevieve von Petzinger’s 32 Symbols

Here is a very interesting take on the same subject. It is the Genevieve von Petzinger TED talk referenced at the start of this section. She has no connection whatsoever with David Talbott and his archetypes. She is a speleologist or spelunker (a person who explores caves). She has documented 32 symbols or “geometric signs” some of which at least, if David Talbott is generally correct about the ancients, should be depictions of the sky. See if you recognize and of them in the following “extra credit” video.

quote her at the end saying she needs to put things back together then point out the first three of her symbols are DT’s stick men

So if you recognized some of these 32 symbols or “geometrical signs” from Genevieve von Petzinger’s cave work as the depicting some aspect of the polar configuration, I would say you have mastered archetypes and are ready to move on.

Compare them to David Talbott’s “stick men” from Symbols of an Alien Sky 18:41 to 24:48

“squashed bell” shape below = “aviform” (#3) in her chart