Mesoamerican Long Count Calendar

 

 

 

 

The boy who cried wolf

Welcome Back! (to respect for the ancients)


People are so gullible. Do you remember the feeling that “maybe, just maybe, there’s something to this Mayan calendar thing”? Well, you’re not alone. The 400th anniversary to the Authorized King James Version of The Holy Bible was the year before 2012. That was no coincidence, I assure you. Have you ever heard the expression “crying wolf”? December 21, 2012 was always intended to be the biggest “crying wolf” incident in recorded history. It succeeded. The Progeny of Pythagoras who have siphoned off trillions of U.S. taxpayer dollars to build the extensive tunnel systems in Colorado and throughout the Western United States of America wonderfully succeeded in lulling us to back to sleep. Even attempting to discuss this ancient calendar which once captivated the imagination of an entire world is now passé and invites ridicule, if not utter disdain. But stop and think for a minute.

The Boy Who Cried Wolf is one of Aesop’s Fables … From it is derived the English idiom “to cry wolf”, defined as “to give a false alarm” in Brewer’s Dictionary of Phrase and Fable and glossed by the Oxford English Dictionary as meaning to make false claims, with the result that subsequent true claims are disbelieved.  — Wikipedia

You can be sure that if December 21, 2012 were the actual end date, you would have never heard about it. Such information about the end time has never been in the public domain. The GMT correlation date date is correct. The problem is that 13 Baktuns is the length of a Great Cycle. It is not a date any more than saying “2012” is a date. The month and day are missing. It is more or less the same with the Mesoamerican Long Count calendar. And there is a serious  year zero problem with 2012. Furthermore, the design and end date of the Mesoamerican Long Count calendar was obfuscated at its inception. This has always been some of the most guarded information in the history of mankind. On this page I will explain that the length of the Mesoamerican Long Count calendar is actually 2160 orbits of Jupiter (the timepiece). It ends December 21, 2018.

It is inherently insane to think that the designers of this calendar would rely on either the rotation of the Earth around its axis or the orbital period of Earth around the Sun to measure vast periods of time.

The Mayans did not design this calendar. Neither did the Olmecs. It is the single greatest intellectual achievement of mankind since the end of the last world. The race of Siddhas (spiritual adepts) who designed it were celebrated the world over. It is indeed everything people thought it was prior to December 21, 2012. I believe the Mesoamerican Long Count calendar is an artifact of a people who lived before the polar configuration of the planets broke apart and Proto-Saturn exploded in 9500 BC.

 

 

 

 

Wayeb glyph

The “Mayan” Calendar and 2017 AD


I use parentheses around “Mayan” because this calendar is a much more ancient artifact. This is done for the sake of popular thought. A more correct name for this calendar is Mesoamerican Long Count calendar. My use of the term Mesoamerican Long Count calendar includes both the Mayan calendar and the Aztec calendar stone. So when you see imagery of the Aztec calendar stone on this website, do not think I am “mistaking” it for the Mayan calendar. The two calendar systems are nearly indistinguishable. That’s for a reason. They are in fact the same calendar.

The notion that Columbus “discovered” America is too preposterous to even consider. He did however provide a context for the Conquistadors and Jesuits to destroy the literary legacy of the designers of the Mesoamerican Long Count calendar. But why bother, you may object, because nothing happened on December 21, 2012?  2012 was crying wolf. It succeed spectacularly. Even mentioning the “Mayan” calendar invites ridicule, if not disdain. My most important work, the work that started me in earnest down this path, is on this calendar. Over five years ago, I discovered the actual unit of measurement of the calendar is orbits of Jupiter. There are 432 orbits of Jupiter in one Great Cycle. The entire calendar of five Great Cycles is (432 x 5 =) 2160 orbits of Jupiter. 432 and 216 are two of the nine sacred numbers. The nine sacred numbers manifest themselves not only in geometry, music, and space, but also in time. This is little understood. The manifestation of sacred numbers in time is as physical as the protons and electrons in an atom and is discussed in the section entitled “Sacred numbers manifest themselves in time also.”  This is why these nine sacred numbers are the religion of the progeny of Jove and, interestingly enough, why there were precisely 216 above ground atomic bomb tests.

The last 400 years of the progeny of Jove morphing from one organization entity to another is of particular interest to the Mesoamerican Long Count calendar. They were the Rosicrucians from 1617 to 1717 (100 years) and the Freemasons from 1717 to 1946 or (230 years, yet another reference to the mysterious 23) before morphing into the CIA from 1947 until the bicentennial in 1976 (30 years), and from 1977 until 2017 (40 years) they are an unnamed entity within the military and government of the United States of America hiding behind “need-to-know” clearances that exclude even sitting presidents. These last two time periods interestingly correspond to Vladimir Putin’s “70 year masterplan for Europe.”

The total span of time from the Rosicrucians to 2017 is a highly symbolic 400 years. This 400 year period is comparable to the 400 years from the publication of the King James Version of the Bible in 1611 to 2011, the year before what was thought to be the end of the so-called “Mayan” calendar. The difference is that the King James Version of the Bible respects the misdirection of the calendar end date of December 21, 2012, while the 400 years of the secret societies evidences a knowledge of the five years, what I call the Great Wayeb, that must be added to the end of that calendar to arrive at the actual end date which was deliberately obfuscated by the designers of the calendar. The actual year of the coming axial tilt is the most guarded knowledge in the entire history of this world. It has never been entirely out in the open. From the Freemasons to 2017 is an equally symbolic 300 years. This is the time that the not-so-secret societies were out in the open. It is even encoded in the year 1717, which is two seventeens or 2017. This reference to 2017 appears again in the fact that the Freemasons were in direct control of the United states of America through the Office of the President from 1776 to 1946, or 170 years total. This is one of those moments where I want to say that if this is “confirmation bias,” then I have raised confirmation bias to a fine art.

Martin Luther, who published his Latin “Disputation of Martin Luther on the Power and Efficacy of Indulgences” in several locations in Germany in 1517, reportedly nailed a copy of what came to be known as his Ninety-five Theses to the door of All Saints’ Church in Wittenberg on October 31, 1517. The publication of this document, notably “in several locations,” (Wikipedia) effectively dated the birth of the Reformation to this very same year. The astute reader will be asking himself, But how could Martin Luther or King James for that matter know about the “Mayan” calendar when the Maya were not fully conquered until the late sixteenth century. The answer to this question is that their knowledge had been acquired hundreds of years earlier by the Pythagoreans.

The “Protestants” as they would later be called, are protesting how the church in Rome is keeping the knowledge the Pythagoreans learned from the Maya a secret and enslaving the common folk in rank ignorance. What Martin Luther and King James did was indeed protesting something, but not what most people think. Their communication to Rome was on a much higher level and was subtlety encoded in the years 1517 and 1611. The Catholic Church has its own “protestors.” The Prophesy of the Popes was published around this same time, in 1595 and has doubtless been aided along the way so that the “last” Pope took office in 2013. It is also highly significant that this is the first Jesuit “white” Pope. Never doubt for a minute that the Jesuits and their “black” Pope control the church in Rome. They are the progeny of Jove inside of the Catholic church. That is why I list them right above “Secret Societies” in the “PROGENY OF JOVE (KNOWLEDGE)” menu.

Some Mayan experts believe the calendar is designed around its end date. Though I am clearly not an expert, I hardily agree with this assessment. If the designer’s primary purpose is to communicate to our age the approximate timing of some great world catastrophe, how could it be otherwise.

But why 2017 instead of 2018? The short answer is that the actual end date of the “Mayan” calendar is December 16, 2013. I will return to this subject momentarily. This is a question I pondered for years. Was it what I would come to call the “Great Mistake”? As somewhat intimated in the “Tomorrowland” movie, is it possible the progeny of Jove are not entirely sure why nothing has happened? I seriously doubt that, but logically speaking there are three possibilities to consider:

  • THE GREAT MISTAKE: The progeny of Jove never fully understood how the “Mayan” calendar works and really thought it ended in 2012. The reason why this is so improbable is that, if they really believed this, they would have made knowledge of the so-called “Mayan” calendar disappear centuries ago
  • THE NINE KNOW: The progeny of Jove have always understood how the “Mayan” calendar works and its actual end date, but that information was kept within their controlling body, which I call the “Nine.” In other words, only a handful of people in the world (now including you) understand the Great Wayeb and that the calendar really did end in 2012 “y un poco” (and a little [more time]) as living Mayan shaman have said, only none of them knew how long “y un poco” was
  • THE UNMENTIONABLE YEAR: It is simply forbidden to allude to the actual year of the axial tilt in any context whatsoever and has been for the past 2,700 years

In the end, I am convinced that the answer is simply that any reference whatsoever to the actual year of the coming axial tilt is strictly forbidden in any context. Nobody ever in the history of the secret societies has been allowed to utter the actual year. In any case, you may be assured the Nine know the correct end date.

interlocking cogs

So what is the difference between 2017 and 2018? The difference between 2017 and 2018 is that 2012 was the end of a Great Cycle or 13 baktuns. It is not a date anymore than saying 2017 is a date. A good analogy would be to say 1999 was the end of the twentieth century whereas it would be much more accurate to say that December 31, 1999 was the end of the twentieth century. The design of the Mesoamerican Long Count calendar involves three cogs. The other two cogs, more or less equivalent to our month and day, must continue turning until they come to an end. When they do, the date is December 16, 2013, which is five days before the winter solstice. Why in God’s name would the designers of the Mesoamerican Long Count calendar end their most sacred calendar five days before the winter solstice? The equinoxes and solstices were the most important days of the year for the ancients worldwide. This question is profoundly important. The answer is that when the calendar was designed, thousands of years before the coming axial tilt, the designers were concerned that the knowledge of the Great Wayeb (i.e. their deliberate obfuscation of the actual end date to protect that information from the uninitiated) might be lost through the ages. They did this to leave us a hint. They knew we would ask ourselves this question. Why? Why five days before the winter solstice? If we need to add five days, then perhaps we need to add five years to 2013 also. By adding five days and five years, you discover the originally obfuscated end date of December 21, 2018. This is why we need to continue to respect the ancients. Does this mean the axis is going to tilt on that specific date? Well, it could actually because the solstices and equinoxes have electromagnetic significance. But I think it merely points to a timeframe in which the designers knew from millennia of observation that either one of dr. Paul A. LaViolette’s galactic superwaves or the approaching Sirius star system always disrupts our solar system in what is a Great Cycle of destruction every 432 orbits of Jupiter (or 432 x 11.8618 = 5124 years).

And guess what? The difference between 2160 orbits of Jupiter and 13 baktuns of 144,000 days is five years. I characterize this as one of the two “Great Anti-Ciphers” left us by the ancients. An anti-cipher is a message that essentially says, “Yes, you are interpreting the data correctly. We knew how difficult this would be for you to believe, so we left this extra message to confirm your understanding.”  The other Great Anti-Cipher is the 144,000 outer casing stones on the Great Pyramid of Giza. They had to fall away before we could count the number of courses of the otherwise completely hidden inner limestone blocks to confirm the following work of Scott Creighton and Gary Osborn.

The wonder of it all! The designers of the Great Pyramid of Giza knew the outer casing stones would fall away before these end times. Even Scott Creighton and Gary Osborn miss the significance of this. It implies that the designers knew that there would be increased seismicity in the centuries leading up to the coming axial tilt. They had to. There is no other possible explanation for them hiding this second Great Anti-Cipher behind the 144,000 outer casing stones. And why are there 144,000 casing stones? For that matter, why is 144,000 mentioned in the Book of Revelation in the context of “hurting” the earth.

Revelation 7:2-4
And I saw another angel ascending from the east, having the seal of the living God: and he cried with a loud voice to the four angels, to whom it was given to hurt the earth and the sea, saying, Hurt not the earth, neither the sea, nor the trees, till we have sealed the servants of our God in their foreheads. And I heard the number of them which were sealed: and there were sealed an hundred and forty and four thousand of all the tribes of the children of Israel.

One thing the work of Scott Creighton and Gary Osborn tells us is that the Great Pyramid of Giza was indeed built after the last axial tilt, which was no later than 3200 BC. I believe both the casing stones and Revelation are pointing to the 144,000 days in a baktun. I base this in large part on an ancient India text.

The Surya Siddhanta is the oldest  surviving astronomical text in the Indian tradition. Some Western  scholars date it to perhaps the fifth or sixth centuries A.D., though  the text itself claims to represent a tradition much, much older. It explains that the earth is shaped like a ball, and states that at the very opposite side of the planet from India is a great city where the  sun is rising at the same time it sets in India. In this city, the Surya Siddhanta claims, lives a race of siddhas, or advanced spiritual adepts. If you trace the globe of the earth around to the exact opposite side of India, you’ll find Mexico. Is it possible that the ancient Indians were well aware of the great sages/astronomers of Central America many centuries before Columbus  discovered America?- the Mayans or Incas. –Knapp, Stephen. 108: The Significance of the Number. Retrieved on 2 January 2014.

I doubt very seriously that this ancient text from India is speaking about the Mayas. If I am right about this, the Mesoamerican Long Count calendar most likely is much older than we think. I will have more respect for my paltry readership when they start to show more interest in my page about this calendar. No one reads it. The so-called “Mayan” calendar is passé now. This lack of respect for the ancients is haughty arrogance and sheer ignorance. They are screaming “axial tilt” at us. The progeny of Jove knows this.

The wonder of it all doesn’t stop here. Using the accepted GMT correlation date, moving forward to 2018, and then backwards (as must be done in this order), the start of the fifth and last Great Cycle in the Mesoamerican Long Count calendar (3106 BC, but which is widely believed to be August 11, 3114 BC) is in perfect agreement with the start of the Yuga calendar of India. (April 20, 3105 BC). It is also close to the approximate the date Nathan Hoffman arrives at for the biblical Deluge (3000 BC) based on a new understanding of Old Testament genealogies as discussed on the biblical Deluge page. In mentioning the later, I am not waxing religious. I think those genealogies were specifically intended to communicate the approximate year of the end of the last world when Proto-Saturn exploded, the axis tilted to an unnatural 23.5°, and the world flooded.

If you think the Mesoamerican Long Count calendar is irrelevant, consider this. If the progeny of Jove know another axial tilt is coming sometime later this year, they may indeed be planning to launch nukes against Russia. Why? Well, first off, they feel invulnerable inside of their granite tunnels. So first they would secret everyone into them and then launch. The reason why is that history tells us the interior of Russia is survivable in a major world catastrophe. They mean for these people to die. Launching is selective killing before Mother Nature takes over and does her thing. Few people understand that even our most devastating nuclear warheads pale in significance when compared to the power of a major earthquake or volcanic eruption. Following an axial tilt, the survivors don’t remember the super tsunamis. The people in coastal areas are the first to die. It is the people in the interior of the continents who survive and what they remember is the unimaginably huge earthquakes and volcanic eruptions that follow such a major disruption of earth’s thin crust. Given what seems to me to be the Great Plan for Depopulation, no one will even remember the launching of these nukes in the new world. In other words, if the progeny of Jove know the the approximate time of the coming axial tilt, they can launch their entire arsenal of nukes against Russia, China, the State of Israel (the Jews being an ancient enemy of theirs who they intend to erase off the face of the earth) , old Babylon, the Persians, and whoever else they want to make damn sure does not survive into the new world, without any repercussions whatsoever, as if it never happened because no one will ever remember that it did. So just maybe an all out nuclear war is not as far fetched as you may think. That is why you might want to reconsider the significance of the Mesoamerican Long Count calendar. I would love to finish my work on that page, but as I said, no one reads it. So why bother? I added this section to my home page in the hopes of changing this sad state of affairs. Wolf, wolf! Time for some more CNN.

 

 

 

 

The Gordian Knot untied

The Mesoamerican Long Count Calendar as 2160 Orbits of Jupiter


My primary work on this subject is what I call simply “the table.” It was my first major discovery when I began pursuing this line of thought (What happened in 3200 BC?) over five years ago, and to this day I consider it my most important contribution. In order to enhance visualization of the mathematical patterns (cycles of destruction discussed below) I discovered in the design of the Mesoamerican Long Count calendar, I have removed the lengthy discussions of events from the table to the Mesoamerican Long Count Calendar page.

 

SPECIAL NOTE: The table opens in its own window. Be sure to use the scroll bar IN THAT WINDOW (as opposed to the one in your browser’s window) to see the whole table.

 

 

You will notice that there are three major cycles of destruction that converge on 2018 AD:

  • 216 ORBITS OF JUPITER: These cycles of destruction happen when the 36, 72, and 108 cycles coincide. They are when Great Cycles happen, but in reality there are ten of them, not just five
  • 972 ORBITS OF JUPITER: This cycle of destruction, which included the nearly total destruction of the planet in 9500 BC, occurs only three times in the calendar, at the peak of the last glacial maximum, in 9500 BC, and this year. I think this may in fact be a cycle of destruction because it is occurring on the ninth iteration of the 108 cycle (which may sound superstitious unless you are steeped in sacred numbers) and the first occurrence of this cycle coincided with Great Cycle 1.5
  • 1080 ORBITS OF JUPITER: I have my doubts about this as a cycle of destruction. If you follow the work of Dr. Paul A. LaViolette, the Solar Proton Event (SPE) which occurs dead center of the Mesoamerican Long Count calendar (which he describes as the worst SPE ever) is a consequence of an earlier Galactic Superwave as discussed in his book Earth Under Fire. At times I have thought the calendar was designed around this date, but if that were true, it would seem to invalidate all other cycles of destruction in the calendar. If this is in fact a cycle of destruction, it too occurs only three times. This cycle of destruction would be equal to one half of the Great Year as defined in the Mesoamerican Long Count calendar. I have yet to transfer my work on the Jose solar cycle to this website, but for now you may want to also notice that the three occurrences of this cycle, one at the start of the calendar 25,621.488 years ago, one dead center of the calendar in 10,793 BC and this year, 2018 AD are the only time an even number of Jose solar cycles occur in the same year as a Great Cycle.

Which of these three cycles may be responsible for the dire predictions of Daniel the prophet, Virgil, and Christ Jesus? I do not presume to think the reader even acknowledges that these are in fact cycles of destruction, but I would answer that question by saying all three. There is an unspeakable wonder about the sacred numbers. They are colliding this year. In as much as I think destruction is the only way forward, to borrow from the 2001: A Space Odyssey movie:

 

calendar2

 

 

 

 

 

 

LINKS LEFT OPEN WHEN LAST WORKING ON THIS PAGE:

2012 and the Mayan Calendar: facts and fantasies

Master Tzolkin Calendar

Mesoamerican Long Count calendar

Explanation of the 13 tones:

The Maya Katun Prophecies

Ancient Text Confirms Mayan Calendar End Date “13 bak’tun date” There is, however, a doomsday prophecy associated with 13 Ahua, which is the actual end date. Use this!

Nevermind the Apocalypse: Earliest Mayan Calendar Found

The Prophecies of Chilam Balam – Introduction

Why the Maya calendar starts in 3114 BC

Spanish conquest of the Maya

How to Read an Aztec Calendar

Maya Civilization Timeline

Mayan Timeline

The Difference Between The Aztec, Maya, Inca, And Olmec  “The Maya were the first Mesoamerican civilization, starting around 2600 B.C.”

Collapse of Aztec Society Linked to Catastrophic Salmonella Outbreak

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Siddhas in America


How likely is it that Central and South America were the intellectual center of the ancient world?  If the Mesoamerican Long Count calendar is what I claim it to be, then this must of necessity be true. DNA evidence tells us the the elongated skulls retreated from Europe to high ground in South America. Is the “race of Siddhas” referred to in the quote below the elongated skulls? Whoever they were, it is clear that Central and South America were not backwaters.
“The Surya Siddhanta is the oldest  surviving astronomical text in the Indian tradition. Some Western  scholars date it to perhaps the fifth or sixth centuries A. D., though the text itself claims to represent a tradition much, much older. It  explains that the earth is shaped like a ball, and states that at the very opposite side of the planet from India is a great city where the  sun is rising at the same time it sets in India. In this city, the Surya Siddhanta claims, lives a race of siddhas,  or advanced spiritual adepts. If you trace the globe of the earth around to the exact opposite side of India, you’ll find Mexico. Is it possible that the ancient Indians were well aware of the great sages/astronomers of Central America many centuries before Columbus  discovered America?- the Mayans or Incas.”
–Knapp, Stephen. 108: The Significance of the Number. Retrieved on 2 January 2014.

siddha definition

Race  is the classification of humans into groups based on physical traits,  ancestry, genetics, or social relations, or the relations between them.  … The term was often used in a general biological taxonomic sense,  starting from the 19th century, to denote genetically differentiated  human populations defined by phenotype.

 

 

The Antiquity of the Mesoamerican Long Count Calendar


 

FROM https://www.timeanddate.com/calendar/mayan.html (sent email for clarification)

Not a Maya Invention
The Maya didn’t invent the calendar, it was used by most cultures in pre-Columbian Central America – including the Maya – from around 2000 BCE to the 16th century. The Mayan civilization developed the calendar further and it’s still in use in some Maya communities today.

 

 

 

 

The All-Seeing “Eye of Providence” is the Great Red Spot on Jupiter

2160 Cycles of Jupiter (the Eye of Jupiter)


What is the basic unit of time used in the design of the Mesoamerican Long Count calendar? On the surface it appears the designers of the calendar decided on days because a baktun consists of 144,000 days (which is 400 years in a 360 day calendar), but this calendar encodes some of the most guarded information in the history of mankind. Nothing is on the surface. The main problem is that, as a unit of time, days are too small. You would not measure a football field in inches, so why would you measure a Great Cycle (5124.2976 years) in days? Using too small a unit of time compounds errors. This is a critical point. See Days as a Unit of Time for a more detailed discussion of this subject.

And using the orbital period of the rocky planets in the inner solar system as units of time was out of the question for the ancients. They knew both Venus and Mars long before they assumed their current orbits. First there was the comet Venus bumping against Earth’s magnetosphere in what is recorded in the Old Testament as the Exodus. Then on February 26th, 747 BC Mars bumped against Earth’s magnetosphere and very substantially changed the length of a year. This is precisely why the designers of the Mesoamerican Long Count calendar did not use years as a unit of time. The ancients knew (as we never could) that nothing in the inner solar system is a reliable timepiece over vast periods of time.

Before anyone could fully understand the design of the Mesoamerican Long Count calendar or grasp the anti-cipher discussed in the next section, there awaited the discovery of the actual unit of time used in this calendar, which is orbits of Jupiter as discussed in The Timepiece of the Ancients is Jupiter. There are 2160 orbits of Jupiter in the Mesoamerican Long Count calendar. Each Great Cycle consists of 432 orbits of Jupiter. For me this was just the beginning. Only the opening scene from Raiders of the Lost Ark when Harrison Ford is “running a booby-trapped gauntlet (complete with an over-sized rolling boulder) to fetch a solid-gold idol” can describe what followed because the actual end date was further obfuscated at the calendar’s inception.

 

 

The Importance of the No. 5 to the Design of the Mesoamerican Long Count Calendar


In this image borrowed from Did Extraterrestrials Create the Maya Calendar?, the 20 day glyphs in the outermost circle of the Aztec calendar stone are divided into fifths. I had wanted to make this image myself before stumbling across this one. I am not very talented with image processing, so this one will have to do. The only thing I would change was to put the points of the star on even day boundaries. The resulting four “days” in each of the five section correspond to the four 108 cycles of Jupiter in each Great Cycle of 432 orbits of Jupiter.

 

 

YUGI CALENDAR EMPHASIZES DIVISION BY FOUR ALSO

 

 

 

 

 

And is it not at least possible that the fact that there are five Great Cycles is yet another “hint” that the number five is profoundly important to understanding the design of the calendar. This is also evident in the Mayan counting system in which five is represented bar a bar instead of five dots.

 

 

 

Enigma

The Two Great Anti-Ciphers


What is an “anti-cipher”? you may ask. Well, a cipher is generally defined as “a secret or disguised way of writing; a code.” The Enigma machine developed by the Germans in WWII is a classic example of a cipher. Wikipedia defines a cipher as follows: “In cryptography, a cipher (or cypher) is an algorithm for performing encryption or decryption—a series of well-defined steps that can be followed as a procedure.” The problem with encoding or encrypting knowledge about the end times intended for people who will be alive thousands of years into the future is that the knowledge could be lost. This possibility requires what I call an “anti-cipher.” Anti-ciphers are included in messages from the ancients that are so profoundly important for the future of mankind that they require a special means of confirming that the encoded message has been correctly interpreted. Basically, the anti-cipher says “as difficult as this may be for you to believe, you have correctly decoded our message to you. Believe it!” Both the encoded message and its anti-cipher are hidden from view, but once discovered reinforce each other. I did not discover The First Great Anti-Cipher built into the design of the Great Pyramid of Giza, but I am the first to recognize it as an ingenious anti-cipher (one that anticipates massive earthquakes before the end time). I did discover The Second Great Anti-Cipher built into the design of the Mesoamerican Long Count calendar. It tells us when to expect the axial tilt, which is next year. These two anti-ciphers are the key to understanding our past, present, and future as an intelligent species.

 

 

 

Leo Tanguma’s 666 “Add five years!” hidden message

The Second Great Anti-Cipher


The First Great Anti-Cipher tells us what to expect, which is an axial tilt. The Second Great Anti-Cipher is discussed in this section. It tells us when to expect it, which is next year.

 

The designers included what I call an “anti-cipher” though, so that one could be sure the actual unit of measurement is the orbital period of Jupiter, which for us is 11.8618 years. I do not mean to suggest that the orbital period of Jupiter has changed since the calendar was designed, but the length of a year most certainly has changed since then.

So let us ignore this possibility and compute the length of a Great Cycle using days.

ONE MAYAN GREAT CYCLE:
144,000 x 13 = 1,872,000
1,872,000 ÷ 365.242 = 5,125

And now let us compute the length of the entire Mesoamerican Long Count calendar using days.

LONG-COUNT CALENDAR:
1,872,000 x 5 = 9,360,000
9,360,000 ÷ 365.2422 = 25,626

The precise number is:

Mesoamerican Long Count Calendar =  25626.830634576179861 years

Now let us compute the length of the entire Mesoamerican Long Count calendar using orbits of Jupiter:

11.8618 x 2160 = 25621.488 years

 

The difference is:

  25626.830634576179861 – 25621.488 = 5.342634576179861 years

Instead of the 5.25 “unlucky five days” of the yearly Wayeb, it is 5.34 years or what I call the Great Wayeb. This is your anti-cipher. This is the designers of the Mesoamerican Long Count calendar telling you, “You got it. The actual unit of measurement is orbits of Jupiter and much like you need to add five days to December 16, 2013 to get to the winter solstice, you need to add five years to get to the start of the grand solar minimum that is about to rock your world.”

There is another way of looking at this anti-cipher. A baktun of 144,000 days is 400 years using the old calendar of 360 days. If you multiply those 400 years by 5.2422 the answer is 2096.88, which divided by 365.2422 is 5.741067160366464. Again, we are pointed to five. The difference is always five, the same as the five unlucky days added to the solar calendar after February 26th, 747 BC. Add five! is the message.

The Mayan who painted those crazy looking murals at the Denver International Airport (the welcome center for the extensive underground tunnel systems in Colorado and throughout the Western United States of America), knows all about the extended end date or Great Wayeb. See Leo Tanguma (DIA murals) for a discussion. I’ve read all of Leo Tanguma’s interviews. He’s a damn (good) liar. He knows. He points to the Sun, creates a plus sign with no less than the feathers of the sacred resplendent quetzal bird (ADD), and then point to an outstretch hand (FIVE) with the last of the three sixes in 666 highlighted. If you think I am imagining this, so be it. You probably think 2160 orbits of Jupiter is a figment of my imagination, too. I tell you what, if you’re right, I’ve taken “confirmation bias” (or Rorschach tests) to a whole new level. But I’m telling you, Leo Tanguma knows. I can assure you of that.

 

 

 

 

The Work of Carl Munck

Stonehenge 2,160 orbits of Jupiter

 

 

Plus five years

Carl Munck is counting the lintels and columns. What I see is five structures.

 

 

Hopewell Indian Fort in Newark, Ohio

The product of the “grid latitude” (Carl Munck’s terminology) is 2160, again representing the 2160 orbits of Jupiter in the Mesoamerican Long Count calendar, and the diameter of the circle is 1056 feet, which is one fifth of a mile.

 

 

 

interlocking cogs

Understanding the Mechanics of the Long Count Calendar


 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The GMT Correlation Date


The Correlation Debate

 

 

The Zero Year Problem


 

 

 

 

 

Ahau (or Ajaw) Logogram

13 Baktuns versus 13 Ahau (the end date)


What is the “end date” or last day of the Mesoamerican Long Count calendar. December 21, 2012 is not the correct answer for a number of reasons discussed in this section. That is not the same thing as saying GMT Correlation date is wrong. Allow me to repeat this critical point, to dispute an “end date” of December 21, 2012 is not  GMT correlation date

 

As stated aove

The correct calendar end date is December 16, 2013. The difference between December 21, 2012 and December 16, 2013 is a rather simple mistake Mayan scholars made regarding the end date. I say again, the GMT correlation date date is correct. It has been confirmed by recent excavations.

The GMT correlation date date is correct. The problem is that 13 Baktuns is the length of a Great Cycle. It is not a date any more than saying “2012” is a date. The month and day are missing. It is more or less the same with the Mesoamerican Long Count calendar. And there is a serious  year zero problem with 2012.

 

 

A baktun (properly b’ak’tun /ˈbɑːkˌtn/;[1] Mayan pronunciation: [ɓakʼ ˈtun]) is 20 katun cycles of the ancient Maya Long Count Calendar. It contains 144,000 days, equal to 394.26 tropical years. The Classic period of Maya civilization occurred during the 8th and 9th baktuns of the current calendrical cycle. The current baktun started on 13.0.0.0.0 — December 21, 2012 using the GMT correlation.

J. Eric S. Thompson pointed out that it is erroneous to say that a Long Count date of, for example, 9.15.10.0.0 is in the “9th baktun”, analogous to describing the year 209 AD as in the “2nd century AD”. However, the practice is so well established among Maya epigraphers and other students of the Maya that to change it would cause more harm than its perpetuation.[2] So the current practice of referring to the current baktun as ”baktun 13” or “thirteenth baktun” may stand, even though it is properly the fourteenth baktun. Alternatively, the first baktun could instead be referred to as the zeroeth to avoid this ambiguity.  — Wikipedia

 

 

 

 

Archaeologists have found carvings in a stone staircase at the La Corona dig site in Guatemala which confirm the ‘end date’ of the Maya calendar, December 21, 2012.

A newly discovered Mayan text reveals the “end date” for the Mayan calendar, becoming only the second known document to do so. But unlike some modern people, ancient Maya did not expect the world to end on that date, researchers said.

“This text talks about ancient political history rather than prophecy,” Marcello Canuto, the director of Tulane University Middle America Research Institute, said in a statement. “This new evidence suggests that the 13 bak’tun date was an important calendrical event that would have been celebrated by the ancient Maya; however, they make no apocalyptic prophecies whatsoever regarding the date.”

 

An ancient Maya text has emerged from the jungles of Guatemala confirming the so-called “end date” of the Maya calendar, Dec. 21, 2012.

Considered one of the most significant hieroglyphic finds in decades, the 1,300-year-old inscription contains only the second known reference to the “end date,” but does not predict doomsday.

It is only the second known inscription which confirms this ‘end date’.

PRALC archaeologists, who in 2012 discovered a Maya text containing only the second known reference to the so-called “end date” of the Maya calendar, toda

Welcome to the wesbite for the archaeological project known by its Spanish name Proyecto Regional Arqueológico La Corona (PRALC).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Middle_American_Research_Institute

http://mari.tulane.edu/PRALC/index.html

 

Stephanie Pappas, Live Science Contributor |

                Ancient Text Confirms Mayan Calendar End Date (see also National Geographic’s In Search of the Lost Empire of the Maya)

2013 Apr 11

a series of high-resolution AMS 14C dates on a wooden lintel

 

The problem is that 13 Baktuns is the length of a Great Cycle. It is not a date any more than saying “2012” is a date. The month and day are missing. It is the same with the Mesoamerican Long Count calendar.is is a rather The explanation why is a technical argument I will not repeat here except to emphasize one more time that thirteen baktuns is not a date. It is the length of one Great Cycle. For a discussion of the actual end date please read 13 Ahau (end date) and Comet ISON. But this begs the question, Why would the calendar end date be five days before the winter solstice? Besides this, knowing the correct end date does not change the argument that not even the ancients would make such a date public. It had to be obfuscated. Ending the Mesoamerican Long Count calendar five days before the winter solstice is an important clue that this is not in fact the actual end date. Mayan shamans who are alive today have said it was always “y un poco.” They just do not know how much more time sould be added o the corr. If the actual end date is somehow doubly obfuscated, an elaborate anti-cipher is required to assure people in the distant future that they are correctly interpreting the designers intent. After all, the future of mankind is at stake here. And the designers of the Mesoamerican Long Count calendar were most assuredly infinitely more intelligent than the Mayans. They left that anti-cipher for us.

 

 

 

 

December 21, 2012


If the Mesoamerican (grossly misnamed “Mayan”) Long Count calendar is everything people thought it was prior to December 21, 2012, do you really believe the powers-that-be would have ever allowed this knowledge to be disseminated to the masses? That would be like throwing the key to Fort Knox on the ground in the middle of Times Square. This is some of the most guarded information in the history of mankind. December 21, 2012 was a “crying wolf” ruse from the beginning. This “GMT correlation” date is accurate. It is the end of thirteen baktuns. The problem is that thirteen baktuns is not a date. The “crying wolf” ruse worked. The problem is that the designers of the Mesoamerican Long Count calendar really were predicting the end of the world by earthquake. And they were highly intelligent. These people really cared about us. To be dismissive towards their work because the world did not end on December 21, 2012 is the height of ignorance.

 

 

Wayeb glyph

The Great Wayeb


The solstices and equinoxes were unimaginably important to the ancients. So why end the most important calendar of all time five days before the Winter Solstice? This is indeed a very important question. It practically cries out, “Add five!.” At the time the calendar was designed, the end time was some two and a half millennia into the future. Would we remember the “unlucky five days?” Would we understand the clue? Certainly we would know from their architecture the important of the equinoxes and solstices. This is what makes the end date of December 16, 2013 so appropriate as a clue to add five years also. The obfuscation of the actual end date was at once necessary (because even in their won time this was some of the most guarded information in the history of mankind), but at the same time threatened the possibility that their message would be lost in time. Something more was needed, some way of letting us know for sure the intended message was to add five years to the end date. This is what I call the anti-cipher.

 

The end date is not understood in large part because it was deliberately obfuscated at its inception.

Gionger’s stuff on the removal of number 18 from Hebrew alphabet

 

 

February 26th, 747 BC


According to Jno Cook, who is surpassed only by David Talbott in advancing the work of Immanuel Velikovsky, in an update of “Chapter 23: Destructions by Mars” in his remarkable work Recovering the Lost World, on February 26th, 747 BC “Mars caused a disturbance of the Earth’s orbit,” changing the length of a year from 360 to 365.25 days.

Fibonacci 60 digit repeat cycle

This date is one of the most important dates in the history of mankind. It represents the loss of perfection because to the ancients the 360 day year was perfection. To fully understand how devastating this was for the ancients, you need to study the work of Lucien Khan (YouTube, Facebook). Lucien Khan is an unsung intellect of the highest order. He understands that Sexagesimal (base 60) numeral system, including our units of time (60 minutes in an hour and twelve hours in a day) and angular (360 degrees in a circle) measurement, are based on the the Fibonacci 60 digit repeat cycle. The Fibonacci 60 digit repeat cycle is well known in mathematics, but when Lucien Khan mapped those 60 digits onto a circle the heavens opened up. Given the fact that our units of time and angular measurement are based on the Fibonacci 60 digit repeat cycle, one may safely assume that the sexagesimal (base 60) numeral system is used throughout the universe and has been for millions if not billions of years. But that, as they say, is another story.

 

 

 

The Five Unlucky Days


Morning the loss of their perfect 360 day year and not wanting to really recognize that the orbital period of Earth had changed, many ancient people simply added “five unlucky days” to the end of their existing 360 day calendars. The Mayans referred to these “unlucky five days” as the Wayeb. Over 2,000 years later, these “five unlucky days” are still an important part of Mayan culture.

The Haab’ was made up of eighteen months of twenty days each plus a period of five days (“nameless days”) at the end of the year known as Wayeb’ (or Uayeb in 16th-century orthography). The five days of Wayeb’ were thought to be a dangerous time. Foster (2002) writes, “During Wayeb, portals between the mortal realm and the Underworld dissolved. No boundaries prevented the ill-intending deities from causing disasters.” To ward off these evil spirits, the Maya had customs and rituals they practiced during Wayeb’. For example, people avoided leaving their houses and washing or combing their hair.

 

Wikipedia

So you see the practice of adding five whatever to calendars is thousands of years old. The “Great Wayeb” adds five years to the Mesoamerican Long Count calendar. It gave us the time to discover the truth herein disclosed.

There are living Mayan shamen who say the end of the Long Count calendar was always the end date “y un poco” (“and a little”). They just don’t know what a little means. This is where knowing the actual end date of December 16, 2013 is critically important. It was a clue the designers of the Mesoamerican Long Count calendar left behind. They lived not long after Mars bumped up against our magnetosphere and changed Earth’s orbital period.

 

 

 

Vigesimal or base 20 numeral system

Cycles of Destruction


The explosion of Proto-Saturn at 9500 BC makes it clear that 108 orbits of Jupiter (or 108 x 11.8618 = 1281.0744 years) is the dominant cycle of destruction. I also think this is why the Mesoamerican Long Count calendar is primarily a vigesimal or base 20 numeral system. The are twenty 108 orbits of Jupiter cycles of destruction in the calendar (20 x 108 = 2160). Every Great Cycle is 432 orbits of Jupiter (or 432 x 11.8618 = 5124.2976 years). Speaking of years, it took me years of studying the Mesoamerican Long Count calendar until I discovered that the basic unit of measurement used in the calendar is orbits of Jupiter. And then it took me years more to uncover the underlying pattern of cycles of destruction, which are 36, 72, and 108 orbits of Jupiter. Only when all three of these occur in the same year is there a “Great Cycle.” Look carefully at the pattern of 36, 72, and 108 orbits of Jupiter cycles of destruction in the following snippet from the Mesoamerican Long Count calendar page:

 

This is the last Great Cycle. What you will notice is that 36, 72, and 108 orbits of Jupiter cycles of destruction also align in the middle of each Great Cycle. In other words, instead of there being only five of these alignments as there are five Great Cycles, there are actually ten. Why? Why are there not ten Great Cycles, one every 216 orbits of Jupiter? I have pondered the answer to this question for years now. One would naturally assume that something spectacular, such as a galactic superwave, occurs every 432 orbits of Jupiter, but the data does not support this assumption for the following reasons:

  • BIRTH OF VENUS: I am very confident that the exact middle of the calendar, Great Cycle 2.5, marks the birth of Venus
  • EXPLOSION OF PROTO-SATURN: The explosion of Proto-Saturn occurred at 108-9 (read as nine 108 orbits of Jupiter ago) when there was only an alignment with 36-27 (no 72)

  • GALACTIC SUPERWAVES: The work of Paul A. LaViolette, PhD suggests that the galactic superwaves which apparently destabilized the polar configuration of the planets occurred roughly 216 orbits of Jupiter apart

So what is the answer? Why are there not ten Great Cycles? Well, if you are familiar with my work then you already know I do not like complicated answers. The truth is always simple. I think the designers of the Mesoamerican Long Count calendar were doing exactly what the they claim, marking the end of the last world, which was the Biblical deluge that occurred in 3106 BC. This is exactly what the Old Testament of the Bible does. So does the Yuga calendar of India. I discuss this event below and in detail in The Biblical Deluge (3106 BC). This is primarily what makes 432 a sacred number. 3106 BC was 432 orbits of Jupiter ago.

 

 

Aztec Calendar Stone

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

December 21, 2012

+ 5.342634576179861 years (125.144606400000027 days)  (4.111189434954009 months)


April, 2017

 

December 16, 2013

April, 2018

 

 

 

 

 

Great Cycle 5, The Great Tribulation


I am utterly astounded that the Mesoamerican Long Count calendar marked the end of the Modern Maximum. I have no patience for people who say that this calendar is no different than ours in the sense that at the end of a calendar year we just go to the store and buy a new one. The extra five years (the “Great Wayeb”) that must be added to it takes us to the beginning of a “grand solar minimum” that will make the Little Ice Age seem tame. It is going to destroy this world by earthquake, exactly as the Mayans predicted. Not in a day. The world goes on. Nothing can destroy this planet in one day and leave us as a species alive. The calendar is a “you live in the end time” marker for humanity. The December 21, 2018 date arrived at after adding five days (the clue) and five years (the “Great Wayeb”) is what I call the extended end date. I discovered the anti-cipher for this date only days before discovering that the Book of Daniel pointed to the exact same year. That moment is etched into my memory. I know exactly where I was standing at the time. The implication is that whoever wrote the Book of Daniel knew about the Mesoamerican Long Count calendar. The extended end date is discussed in The Great Wayeb (“y un poco”) and Its Anti-Cipher and most intriguingly in Leo Tanguma (DIA murals).

 

Matthew 24:21

This date marks the end of the Mesoamerican (Mayan) Long Count calendar plus five days (the clue) and five years (the “Great Wayeb”). What will happen? The Bible says “for then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.” The Mayans say this world ends because of earthquakes. It is clear from the Zodiac that the “Age of Aquarius” involves a weakening of the Sun resulting in an unprecedented influx of galactic cosmic rays (GCR) which are directly responsible for the worldwide flooding and increased lightning, seismic, and volcanic activity that is already happening to this planet. The implication is that our Solar system’s binary relationship with Sirius is ultimately responsible for the Sun’s “hibernation” or dormancy at this time during the misnamed “precession of the equinoxes.” There is an inverse relationship between solar output and GCRs. We are headed into uncharted territory.

 

 

Great Cycle 4, The Biblical Deluge (often discussed as “3200 BC”)


See “Were the Pyramids Built Before the Flood? (Masoretic Text vs. Original Hebrew)” by Nathan Hoffman (NathanH83) on YouTube at https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VI1yRTC6kGE

 

 

Great Cycle 3, Earth Assumes a new Solo orbit Around the Sun


EARTH ASSUMES A NEW ORBIT

Orphaned Earth assumes a new solo orbit around the Sun and the temperature record finally re-stabilizes.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Great Cycle 2.5, The Birth of Venus


VERY IMPORTANT POTENTIAL CONTRADICTION WI TALBOTT SEE 1:14:25 IN Symbols of an Alien Sky (Full Documentary)

HE HAS THE CENTER OF THE AZTEC CALENDAR STONE AS MARS

 

Marks the end of the Younger Dryas cooling

Interestingly, Randell Carlson in his YouTube lecture on the “Catastrophe at 12,900 BP” (a favorite subject of his), says “In the aftermath of this catastrophe, is when we find stepping onto the world stage the goddess…the age of the goddess when humans, the descendants of the survivors, are worshipping the Earth in the form of a corpulent pregnant goddess…” (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AbnrDbbfyxE) In a different YouTube interview (Joe Rogan Experience #725) with Graham Hancock & Randall Carlson, the date is moved to 12,800 BP, which is (1950 – 12800 =) 10,850 BC.

 

As with all Mesoamerican cultures, including the Mayans, the Aztecs inherited their calendar system from the original designers of the Mesoamerican Long Count calendar. We do not know who these people were. However, the design doubtless dates back to 600-700 BC when, according to Jno Cook in his remarkable work Recovering the Lost World, “Mars caused a disturbance of the Earth’s orbit on February 26th, 747 BC,” changing the length of a year from 360 to 365.25 days. At this time the attention of perhaps some of the most advanced astronomers ever alive on this planet was focused on understanding the new configuration of the planets so familiar to us today. The similarities of the Aztec calendar system to that of the Mayans is simply too great for this to be otherwise.

For anyone familiar the work of David Talbott, that Miley Cyrus tongue sticking out of the face in the MIDDLE of the Aztec Sun (or Calendar) Stone featured on this website represents the planet Venus. This is actually profoundly important because it is an affirmation that at the center of the Mesoamerican Long Count calendar (10,793 BC or Great Cycle 2.5) is the birth of Venus. How did I arrive at this conclusion?

  1. It is clear the birth of Venus preceded the explosion of Saturn because Venus is well documented to have been part of the polar configuration.
  2. Nothing less than the explosion of Proto-Saturn can account for the total destruction of 9500 BC
  3. Ergo the birth of Venus preceded the explosion of Proto-Saturn

This logic is so simple and straightforward, the only real question is when did the polar configuration break apart. For the answer to that we go full circle and look to the evidence of the giant skeletons being on or near the surface.

 

CUT N PASTE

 

 

If you look at my post on the basic structure of the so-called “Mayan” long count calendar and read all of my other stuff already posted (a tiny amount of the material I am sitting on), you will see that I am somewhat conflicted about what happened at two of the four main dates in the history of new solar system configuration, which began when the “Proto-Saturn” solar system configuration of the Electric Universe team destabilized and broke apart. Those dates are as follows:

13355 BC
END OF SECOND MAYAN AGE
The Proto-Saturn solar system configuration of the Electric universe team is destabilized interrupting a temperature cycle that is over 300,000 years old. Nothing will ever be the same.

10793 BC (Great Cycle 2.5)
BIRTH OF VENUS FROM SATURN (EU) marks the end of the “Younger Dryas cooling”

9512 BC
Saturn FINALLY explodes and orphans Earth.  marks the end of the PLEISTOCENE and start of the Holocene epoch
8231 BC

END OF THIRD MAYAN AGE
Orphaned Earth assumes a new solo orbit around the Sun and the temperature record finally re-stabilizes (at least from a historical perspective). Venus and Mars become comets.

The dates themselves are not in question. The agree perfectly with the Greenland ice core temperature records.  What I am not sure about is 9500  versus 10793 BC. One is Saturn exploding and the other is the birth of Venus. This is solvable though based on when the worship of Venus began, which is to say the way it is represented above is probably wrong. In either case, Earth was destroyed because it was bombarded with plasma resulting in a 30 degree tilt of the planet.

 

 

The Protruding Tongue (archetype)

But how can we be sure that Proto-Saturn exploded in 9500 BC and rained plasma down on the Earth? Only serious students of David Talbott can answer this question. One of the hundreds of “archetypes” (global patterns) he has discovered buried in mythology is the “Star of chaos: Protruding tongue” for the planet Venus. Venus is at the heart and soul of worldwide mythology. It is also at the center of the Aztec Sun (or Calendar) Stone. As discussed in Birth of Venus (Great Cycle 2.5),  this is a reflection of the fact that the birth of Venus also marks the middle (Great Cycle 2.5) of the Mesoamerican Long Count calendar.

 

One of hundreds of David Talbott’s archetypes: Venus as the “Star of chaos: Protruding tongue

Aztec Sun (or Calendar) Stone with Protruding tongue in the middle of the calendar

 

For other examples of this archetype, see Birth of Venus (Great Cycle 2.5).

 

 

 

Great Cycle 2, Second Galactic Superwave


END OF SECOND MAYAN AGE
SECOND galactic superwave
The “Proto-Saturn” solar system configuration of the Electric universe team is destabilized
This event interrupts a heartbeat-like temperature cycle that has been stable for well over 300,000 years old. Nothing will ever be the same. Paul LaViolette places this date at 15,870 BP (13,920 BC), which in his book Earth Under Fire he gives as either 13,865 or 13,860 BC.

 

Great Cycle 1.5, First Galactic Superwave


FIRST galactic superwave
Paul LaViolette has Sagittarius shooting his arrow through the dead center of the Milky Way galaxy at 18,200 BP (16,250 BC). He believes this date or 15,870 BP (13,920 BC) is an either-or proposition, but both dates are within 500 years of a “Great Cycle” which could indicate that the galactic superwaves are recurring every 216 orbits of Jupiter (Plato’s number), which is one half of a “Great Cycle”. This would imply that yet another galactic superwave was responsible for the birth of Venus and possibly for Earth assuming its present orbit around the Sun after the proto-Saturn solar system of the Electric Universe team broke apart.

 

 

FOOTNOTES:


 

 

Original End Date Argument (Carefully Preserved)

The following is a carefully preserved argument for the correct end date of the Mesoamerican (Mayan) Long Count calendar from the Godlike Productions website, which is a discussion forum for “UFOs, Conspiracy Theorists, and the Lunatic Fringe,” which is admittedly a website description that does not readily lend itself to being a credible source for such an immensely important argument. Nevertheless, this is a singularly strong argument for a different end date than the popularly known and believed December 21, 2012. It is an exact copy, with only frivolous, irrelevant, or unsubstantial comments excluded and some minor formatting changes. This argument for a end date of December 16, 2013 is profoundly important, which is why I could not risk it being deleted from the Godlike Productions website.

The author of these posts is unknown, identified only as “Anonymous Coward” (which is a default user name) with the User ID 833688 from the United States. If anyone knows who this person is, please contact me. There are two posts. The first is dated 12/21/2009 09:12 PM. The second is dated 12/22/2012 07:29 PM.

FROM http://www.godlikeproductions.com/forum1/message948708/pg1

original post (2009)

FROM http://www.godlikeproductions.com/forum1/message2091882/pg1

second post (2012)